And by the time the crash of those machine-gun toms had settled down to a comparatively gentle bass roll, I was so shell-shocked that I was ready for the utterly evil but curiously soothing female voice which bade

Fleeting enshadowed Thou art privy to my sin

Umm...yes?

Yes? Yes. If there is darkness lurking anywhere in your soul, Cradle of Filth will find it. And when they do, the infection will spread through your soul with the virulence of your favorite Level Four hemorrhagic fever. Not since Die Krezen's first album have I been disturbed by music. But Krezen was, at best, akin to insane rambling. The music of Cradle of Filth, on the other hand, is quite purposefully seductive and utterly premeditated. It's insane all right-in that Hannibal Lecter way that knows exactly what it's doing and is so utterly immoral that evil for its own sake is pleasure. Like the Viscount de Valmont, CoF wants you to know the difference between good and evil and still not be able to stop yourself.

I am not an easy sell on metal. Not at all. When I supposedly liberated myself of the shackles of corporate metal in high school, for the purity (BWHAHAHAHA...ooh dear...excuse me...) of hardcore punk I simply assumed the followers of metal were stumbling after a basically dead form of music. All that changed when I heard Angel of Death by Slayer. I was humbled into a quivering mass of protoplasm by this metal classic which should rightly hang in Hell's Hall of Fame. Further investigation left me cold, however. Venom was O.K. but for some reason the enlightenment classicist in me could not take them seriously. Far less could I stomach some of the tripe that had come out of Scandinavia, which sounded like a bunch of steroid and crystal-meth charged Vikings suffering an acute attack of explosive diarrhea.

Then, in 1997, I read an article on CoF in the Goth-as-fuck zine Bloodsongs. I was impressed with Dani's take on some matters of spiritual significance. So I went out, utterly unprepared, and bought Dusk and Her Embrace. I have counted myself one of their minions ever since.

Chance to talk to one of the members? Great. I'm there. Not just any member either, but founding member and bassist Robin Graves, on the phone from Ipswich where Cradle of Filth is preparing for their European tour. The tour is in support of their latest album Midian, which debuted, appropriately enough on Halloween, and is available through Music for Nations. One of the most incredible things about Cradle of Filth is how well the band has progressed in spite of more recording label and member swaps than a gas chamb-err, roomful of polyamourous hippie couples. The experience? Utterly disarming and benign. Bit like that succubus that came in my window last night really...

E.C.: Let's see, Cradle's been around since what, 1991 is it?

Robin: Well it's around that date that the people in the band (although not the same lineup that ended up on the first album) first started using the name Cradle of Filth. Before that there were some projects going with various members, although I wasn't involved. I basically came in on the second demo.

E.C.: And had you been playing black metal before this?

Robin: Not really, no. Before Cradle of Filth I was more or less into my thrash metal, and then I met up with Paul Ryan in Ipswich-the original lead guitarist-he was well into his Death Metal and you know a lot of the bands that I sort of loved and adored he was fairly unfamiliar with a lot of that, although I think he did like it once we introduced it to him. But he still hung on to a lot of his Death Metal roots and at the same time I sort of hung to my thrash metal roots as well. So we had something to offer each other while he stayed true to his Death Metal and I the Thrash.

E.C.: So you got a kind of a hybrid & sound & thing? [Note to self: stop intimidating interviewees with excessive technical jargon.]

Robin: Yeah, it was a sort of mongrel & metal.

E.C.: Now if you don't mind (this being more of a general music interest publication) could we talk about sub-genres? I mean in electronica you've got your house and trance and what not-and people come along and say "O.K. You've your thrash metal, your black metal, your death metal..."

Robin: And its all metal to them isn't it?

E.C.: Yes! Yes it is, and I was wondering if you could give us your take on the differences?

Robin: Well...thrash metal, I think, derived from people who appreciated the old style rock and roll stuff like Judas Priest and sort of, you know, combined it with the punk/skate/hardcore thing.

E.C.: So would you maybe classify...umm...Napalm Death as getting on for thrash metal?

Robin: Umm...well they were more of a hardcore band. They were like...noise & grindcore, I don't think they really started off with a genre, I think they actually created a genre of their own.

E.C.: [Laughs to hide embarrassment at poor scene knowledge] O.K.

Robin: There were a lot of American death metal bands that kind of started up that kind of genre of music and I think bands like Napalm Death, because they were just such an extreme hardcore band with really de-tuned guitars, you know tuned to, like, zed-flat! Anyway & because they had this grungy production and such an aggressive style they got tagged with this death metal thing. Even today I don't think that Napalm Death is the same as a lot of the typical death metal bands.

E.C.: Fair comment-and I have to admit that I first heard about Napalm Death through the hardcore community.

Robin: Even on the Scum album which had the most evident cause to be labeled death metal or anywhere near that music genre.

E.C.: What about Venom? You've covered them, they get brought up as a major influence & where do you put them in all this? Did you ever get to tour with them?

Robin: No. No, never got to tour with them. We have met Venom a couple of times, and then obviously Kronos came in and did some vocals for the Dusk album. Venom-again-I think, like Napalm Death started their own genre but Venom named theirs, of course, on the second album-Black Metal.

E.C.: So they coined the phrase?

Robin: Yeah, but I don't think they turned black metal into what it is today. There's this metal band from Sweden called Bathory, who I always thought were very death metal, but that's because the first thing I ever heard of by them was, like, their third album. They kind of took the original vibe from what Venom were doing and delivered it with a true Swedish sort of "death metally" style. And the difference between what Bathory was doing and what a lot of other Swedish death metal bands were doing was they didn't actually de-tune their guitars, they left it all at concert pitch. And what you ended up with was a studio production with a really dark evil vibe to it.

E.C.: I guess that sort of brings me up to the next question-in this Bloodsongs interview with Dani and Nick Barker they talked a little about the Norwegian scene and all the news that was coming out of there-and I got the impression that Cradle of Filth was sort of holding a torch for black metal in Britain. Has that situation improved?

Robin: I think that the situation for us got better as the band got better because we've gotten out of the rat-race of "who's cool" and "who's true" because at the end of the day it doesn't really matter whether people think we're "cool" or "true" & we're just a lot more successful. Yeah I suppose Dan was right about the holding a torch for England and that, although at the time I didn't care. I just loved the music. I think when all that shit kicked off I sort of thought this isn't about music this is about immaturity and not having a very good clue about everyday life as a whole. It's a bit like the whole hip hop thing, isn't it?

E.C.: You know, I remember thinking when I read about the whole East Coast/West Coast thing how much it reminded me of the murder of that guy & umm & I keep wanting to call him Epidermis-but that's not his name...

Robin: Euronymous?

E.C.: Yes, that's right!

Robin: [Robin laughing uncontrollably in the background]

E.C.: And that other guy, the one that killed him...umm...Count What's-his-face?

Robin: Count Grishnackh. Yeah you know I think they were trying to promote the music and sort of got caught up in their own social rat race of cool to see who's the most elite out of all of them.

E.C.: I've read some of Anton LeVey's later writings, not that I count myself in any way expert, I suppose I'm impressed with what I've seen so far.

Robin: Yeah you know I think a lot of those so-called satanic writers, they take all this supposed knowledge and then they give it away? I mean why would you give all that knowledge away? Why not keep it for yourself and for your loved ones?

E.C.: O.K. so this is the last question that has anything to do with Satanism & I read in a 1998 Terrorizer article that Anton LeVey's daughter Zeena had met up with you on a Los Angeles date and discussed some collaborative work.

Robin: No nothing came of that & well I never heard anything about it, maybe it was something Dan heard about that he didn't share it with anybody & maybe he didn't care to.

E.C.: Right.

Robin: Yeah I couldn't even begin to say why he wouldn't say it, tell us it, but where had you heard about that?

E.C.: Oh it was an article mainly on the New York leg of the tour and was mainly just Cradle of Filth did this and that from night to night on tour-about four lines and in the same paragraph they were talking about Glenn Danzig stopping by in Los Angeles.

Robin: Yeah we did bump into Glenn Danzig and he seems a cool bloke.

E.C.: Now you've covered a Misfits tune on Cradle to Enslave I believe it was?

Robin: Yeah that's right, "Death Comes Ripping."

E.C.: I'm not all that familiar with the Misfits stuff but I remember something familiar in that "oooooohhhhhh" chorus line or whatever that made me think, "that doesn't sound like Cradle of Filth."

Robin: [laughs] Well that chorus wasn't like the whole band, you know, we had the studio staff or just whoever was around you know, who was like, getting into it and we're like "Right. Get in that fucking booth and do some vocals."

E.C.: O.K. Nice one. O.K. Gosh, Cradle of Fear, the Movie. Got to ask about it.

Robin: Right well I think its already up on the web-I haven't really had a chance to see it other than the odd, you know, quick trailer bit. I don't even know what the whole thing entails. There is the one scene & "Her Ghost in the Fog" & no no & not "Ghost in the Fog" & "Lord Abortion" is in one scene. I really couldn't tell you what the sound track's going to be like. I shouldn't imagine it's going to be anything spectacular because the whole thing's meant to be a sort of low-budget video nasty.

E.C.: Yeah well. So some of the stuff off Midian but no new stuff?

Robin: Well there might be something that we cobbled together for it...

E.C.: O.K. You're obviously in a very critical period in your career. A few years ago here in Austin, nobody had heard of Cradle of Filth, and now I can remember a whole series of instances & "I've seen a Cradle of Filth shirt at this club or that petrol station." Clearly your popularity is picking up.

Robin: Yeah, I guess we are in a critical stage. Obviously you know, we're aware that things are getting better for us. I don't know that I'm always happy about the speed of the progress. But sometimes when you know you're getting bigger I still feel like the guy that was in an underground band and I get really uncomfortable and you know its not like I can just go down to any old club in Ipswich and just be myself because there's always these kids who are treating you like you should be able to handle yourself in a "star" situation and they get really disappointed when you all you can say is: "all right mate?"

E.C.: So if you don't mind now I'd like to read to you from your own bio (for the edification of our readers) from the Cruelty and the Beast album:

Robin: All right.

E.C.: "This libertine, a merciless necrophile which employs a drug which induces death-like sleep. His victims are nailed in coffins and buried, shortly after which, they revive. The libertine waits by the grave, placing his ear to the soil to hear a scream; if they do it suffices to make him discharge upon the gravestone. He has killed and then enjoyed most of his loved ones in this fashion."

Robin! That's very disturbing stuff!

Robin: [There is much laughter from Robin at this juncture.] Have you read Gian Pyres' one? It's the best I think.

E.C.: Umm...oh yes, "...he twists her head right round until she stares backward..."

Robin: "...In this way he may gloat over her tortured face and buttocks!"

E.C.: Good heavens yes. That is rather creative isn't it. [We are both laughing now.]

Robin: Well it's a joke of course, its just our sense of humor. It's not meant to invoke any kind of inspiration to anybody-it's meant to make them laugh. It's like the music-it's all got a kind of cheeky dark humor to it.

E.C.: How long do you think it's going to be, with all the access that people have to all aspects of pop culture, that all this is just going to be considered blasé?

Robin: Well you've got to keep moving with the times I suppose. You know you can't keep going over the same jokes over and over again because people stop laughing. And along the same line, if you're going to be evil all the time-well people are going to get bored with that too. I mean after we did the last album people came up and said they didn't expect it to sound like the last one because it was a more "underground" sounding album and people say: "Gosh, underground metal is still commercial." And it is.

E.C.: So I suppose you just hang it out on a flagpole and see who salutes.

Robin: And expecting that not everybody's going to salute. You just go on and do what you want with your music.

E.C.: Robin I look forward to your U.S. tour in 2001. Thanks so much for your time.

Robin: My pleasure Wylie. Cheers.

In the gothic community in Austin, it is common vernacular to refer to something which is of the highest worth and note: as "rocking like Slayer." (As in: "so and so rocks like Slayer.") Let me say, for the record, that Robin Graves Rocks Like Slayer. But that's only because saying "Rocks Like Cradle of Filth" takes too long...